Carpet Cleaning Fraud?

[Andrew Evans]

Hi this week I was faced with having to clean some carpets at the top of a block of apartments in central Cambridge.

The carpets were a heavy wool berber, the sort which normally take forever to dry and smell of dog usually!
No lift no parking and a long way up a narrow staircase, what to do?

Having converted my Rotary to use Mikes Puks and now they wont take Micro fibre pads I only had one option to my mind.

I have often used the floormac to agitate and break up heavy soiling before rinsing, never used it as a stand alone system before.

I got some fusion clean and a pad from Nick, as usual I practised on my own carpets first, downstairs tufted wool mix upstairs Poly prop in the bedrooms.

Earlier in the week I cleaned my lounge in the normal and recommended way, but there are a couple of patches where my dog lays which will not budge, I am sure you know the type I mean, Upstairs I have my eldest sons room .

I used the floormac + fusion clean + black brush + pad to say I was pleased with results is putting it mildly!

I turned up at the clients apartment did the usual prep, there were two areas of concern but to be honest the rest of the carpet was in good condition, one area was a big black spot by the bedroom door the other was where dust and dirt had collected in the strip by the front door....... Total success in and out in 40 minutes.(carpets dry yes dry by time I packed up) ok may just be slightly damp but this was a heavy wool berber. I would expect it to be damp for several hours if not slightly moist the next morning.

So at last here is the question I know the best method to clean carpets is spray extraction......But this worked better on spots........It didn't feel right as it was too easy? The client was happy paid up and commented how good the carpets looked. I normally say look two weeks later as a test, 1 week later my carpet Marks have not reappeared and they were bad.

I have struggled on on trying to build my business for 5 years using spray extraction and it has/is a struggle could this be a New USP marketed right and using a combination of solutions brushes and pads be used as a stand alone system.............Or is it really just a fraud?

I am seriously thinking of marketing this as a seperate specialist company along the lines of quickest drying times you have ever seen or your money back etc.

Would appreciate your comments.

Thanks

Andrew

 

[Dan Paton]

Lm cleaning in domestics only seems to be only looked on as fraud by some Cc's on forums. Customer couldn't give a monkeys as long their carpets look cleaner than they where before they called you .

 

[Ian Hare]

They will look clean, but spray extract next day and dirty water will greet you.

 

[Joe Hatton]

I still think LM using a rotary and maybe less so an orbiter at best is skimming the surface and not far below,
It seems logical that if you have suction then you going to get the deeper dirt (and nasties) out of a carpet and therefore extraction is going to be most effective.
Certainly for those clients who are on a lower budget them LM could be the way to go, you got to get your mind round the fact you may be doing a "fastest drying time" but you not doing "best clean ever". But visual results count high in some situations.

 

[Jared Long]

Good job Andrew

It maybe a good system to use on some carpets, lightly soiled, maintenance cleans etc, but isn't going to be suitable for every carpet situation you come across, as mentioned above, you'll only be really cleaning the top of the pile which yes may give a visually good appearance but further down the pile there will remain un touched soiling which only extraction can touch.

Why not offer it is an add on to the business, kind of top up cleans, after extracting one year, return quarterly, six monthly for top up cleaning, then extract again yearly, two yearly, carpet manufacturers require you to have your carpets cleaned yearly to two yearly to uphold the warranty. It could Almost be like a car service schedule, where you have minor and major services

 

[Richard Cole]

Andrew, I think there are several carpet cleaners who have successfully built a business around LM cleaning, if you have the kit already why not just add it to your services and give the customer the option. As others have said H.W.E will give the most thorough clean but L.M can give a visual clean and advantages of fast drying that is all some customers will want.

 

[Alan Lui]

looking at it from a clients point of view, only a few would be bothered about what may lurk beneath the surface especially when they cant see it, most would only be concerned about, the price.... and the finished result....... just my thoughts as a non cc'er

 

[Andrew Evans]

They will look clean, but spray extract next day and dirty water will greet you.

I know you are right Ian but have you ever run a micro fibre pad over a still wet carpet and got transfer?

 

[Andrew Evans]

Thanks for your answers and will definitely use it for maintenance cleans. Is it two separate markets I wonder though. Thanks again and Al get your wand going.

 

[Dan Paton]

Yes HWE removes more dirt. That's fact but there are a lot of companies making a lot of money out there with nothing more than a rotary (some heated) or a large op machine etc. Joe I disagree I've been down the route offering LM cleaning as a budget service and it got customers but I soon came to realise that IMO it should be offered as a premium service focusing on the dry times, no open doors, no noise pollution etc(marketing terms nothing more). I don't think all the fusioneers out there are offering low budget services. Quite the opposite in fact. Although I do stand by what my first post says. Most customers simply don't care. Andy you said you will market this as a separate specialist company so you wont ever actually see the ones who only want HWE as they'll look at your LM website/marketing media etc and see exactly what their getting. Dry fusion etc has proved there is a market for it so nothing wrong in servicing both markets with different websites etc. Good luck with it

 

[Steve Swinney]

For the best deepest most thorough clean ever .....a combination of the 2 methods HWE then Bonnet. If you only HWE & then go over with a bonnet you will get dirt transfer to pad.....likewise if you LM clean then follow up with HWE you will get crap in your tank.....the best of both worlds as a package.......but who will pay for this time & effort.

 

[Andrew Evans]

Dan and Steve both tally with my experiences. Joe I know what you are saying but doesnt the solution do the work if not why not just spray and suck. I guess I am looking for a diff USP. But will still do the spray extraction.. interesting though and the custy was happy to.

 

[Simon Nickson]

Andrew you have arrived at the conclusion that many recent entrants to the industry do - I know of half a dozen new entrants who now use LM /encap on 99% of domestics - they are thriving, with constant happy customers, etc.
However those who have invested thousands in a Truck Mount, or higher spec porty, or those who have vested interests in companies selling cleaning machines,training courses,products etc will OPPOSE your findings pointing to all sorts of outdated ideology and whats best practice and cleans deepest, etc.
The fact remains that one could buy a £150 second hand Oreck/Floormac, a good second hand Sebo or similar £100 ish ,pump spray £20 and some encap £30 and clean with just a vac and spray very easily and with many happy clients - despite what those older or any carpet cleaner would say - the actual facts as do your facts and experience - support that for less than £300 quid you can be ready to go and clean very well and successfully.
I would think that in another ten years almost all carpet cleaning will be using this method.
You know cowboys in the Wild West for many years opposed the railways and even more so the Motor Car saying neither would take off. Think of those opposing encap for domestics in a similar way - if they have invested thousands of pounds in portables or god forbid T/Mounts - they are very very reluctant to accept the fact that you with your floormac can OUT CLEAN them
As to marketing if you promote Dry (as opposed to VLM) then you can smash wet cleaners to bits so they dont have a leg to stand on - as seen by zero dry time franchise and others.
Also I had this discussion with Joe in person and Daniel is right Dry (VLM) should always be marketed as a Premium service /cost due to its many benefits - its so easy to market and given a choice WET or Dry customers choose dry and are happy to pay double usually.
Having said all that I clean 80 % domestic with HWE due to my love affair with SPM.
Also I am shorty to get a new HWE system maybe mid summer - so each to their own.

 

[Jared Long]

looking at it from a clients point of view, only a few would be bothered about what may lurk beneath the surface especially when they cant see it, most would only be concerned about, the price.... and the finished result....... just my thoughts as a non cc'er

Spot on your right customer probably doesn't care whats at the base of the carpet, and yes they want that visual wow, but how many times have I heard ( not aimed at LM cleaning ) from customer's " yes my carpet looked clean for a month or so then it just got dirty again, I won't be using that cleaning company again"

 

[Dan Paton]

If the carpet has rapid re-soiling it's the operators fault for wrong chemical choice, poor use of etc. Regardless of what system is used . Both HWE and LM can cause rapid re-soiling in the wrong hands

 

[Andrew Evans]

Interesting thoughts I am not talking about a quick service. Will still pre vac etc and groom. As for re soiling so far so good on my carpets.
With detergent free solurions re soiling shouldnt happen?

 

[Ian Hare]

Re soiling is not so much the problem, rather it is the soil that hasn't been removed.

 

[Steve Allan]

Interesting thread and food for thought. I'm going to give this method a go tomorrow on some s/h/l and see how we go.

 

[Steven Butler]

Me too on my own and families carpets this week.

 

[Joe Hatton]

I use both systems, that is water extraction and low moisture, that is rotary and Floormac.
I know there is good money to be had from both methods, either way you need the client to pay it.
I have had a DryFusion system with their products, I have had a Texatherm system with their products. Visually very good results, but I know that deep down the carpet it not as clean as it could be.
I put myself in the situation.... if I was the paying customer what system would I want the professional carpet cleaner to use? For my own home it would be water extraction every time. If I was moving out of a rented property and I was offered a lower priced lm clean - yes, that would be fine. If I was moving out of a rented property and being asked to pay a premium for a lm clean - no way hosea.
BUT of course the average client is not as aware as I am of carpet cleaning methods available and their end results (seen or unseen).

Of course, each markets their own business in the way to earn profits.
As I said, I use water extraction and lm. I am part way through a office clean mainly using lm BUT I had my extractor out for a busy grubby corridor after I used the rotary and the water was black. I did go over with a dry pad to try to knock out any potential wicking.